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rlslay
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Posted: Friday, July 03, 2009 at 12:55:49 AM | IP Logged

This is what advice Homeboy gave me for my up coming course Lakeside of Georgia Golf Club...

OK Robert. I did 3 things: took a run thru the course, looked at your tca and then took a

look at what the details of the course look like in CLTool by creating a project.

I actually get no lag per se when I play the course, but I took notes of the avg fps as I

went thru it. On my computer, I generally try to get somewhere in the 40-60's on my

courses. I never change my settings because I like the baseline for comparison purposes.

There are a few holes that are a little low, but nothing too bad.

1 - 33
2 - 41
3 - 38
4 - 37
5 - 48
6 - 35
7 - 51
8 - 31
9 - 38
10 - 37
11 - 44
12 - 43
13 - 45
14- 42
15 - 43
16 - 41
17 - 33
18 - 40

By comparison, Bethpage Black had fps in the low 20's on my computer, which wasn't laggy for

me, but did noticeably tax my system.

The relatively low fps on Lakeside are due to a number of factors:

1. Long sightlines -- holes 1 and 8 have the lowest fps mostly due to the long sightline

looking straight across your plot from south to north. Not much you can do about that. The

one thing I might have done when laying out your plot way back at the beginning is to take

some liberties with the size of the giant lake and pull the holes along the top down a

couple hundred yards.

2. Object Count/Density of trees and bushes -- this has an effect on fps, especially bushes

that are close to the golfer (like on the tee box). This will have an immediate effect on

the fps on the hole. You have 16,655 objects, which is a ton. My courses generally have no

more than 8,500 or so. Try to thin them out as much as possible.

3. Object variety -- by creating a project in CLTool and analyzing the library details, I

can see that you've used about 45 different types of plantings from 7 different stock

libraries. This definitely is affecting your fps. A lot of memory is being used to render

all of those objects from several different libraries. What I would do is use CTRL and

double click to change all of one kind of tree to another a few times to get rid of some

libraries and reduce the number of different kinds of trees/bushes.

4. Sticky libraries -- in CLTool, I can see that you have at least 7 sticky libraries

(libraries that were once used but are no longer). The "remnants" of those libraries are

still using resources during gameplay. Use the CLTool feature to remove the sticky

libraries.

5. Set course perimeter -- you can remove a couple hundred yards of unnecessary plot (and

sightlines) along the bottom left edge of your plot. This will also reduce your overall

point count of the base plot a little bit.

Otherwise, course looks very nice and plays well. Nice job with the bunkers and streams.

Good luck.
Roger 
 
 
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Squirrely
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Posted: Friday, July 03, 2009 at 8:30:09 AM | IP Logged


Thanks for posting this, good info for sure.
Homeboy is like a my favorite star football player with all this stuff, and if I ever met him in RL, I probably ask for his autograph. May sound silly(kinda dumb) to some, but it's the truth, and I'm far from a sissy. Those tutorials he did really help me so much it ain't funny, and without them, I wouldn't have been able to do this killer world of making TW courses, that simple. Plus he makes such awesome courses too, and if I can reach even1/2 the quality/performance of his works one day, I'd be one happy camper.....

With the course I'm trying to make right now. I run into something all the time it seems(especially knowing what I can do or can't do with going over a plot spot again if need be), and any info like this great for us noobs, and much appreciated. I brought alot of this pain on myself for trying such hard bunkers/course, but I was so excited with this stuff at first, I got carried away with things, and it's been a eye opener to say the least. Florida flat land course is sounding very good to me right now.....LOL
Was very blind with things, and still am, but I shouldn't have even attempted this kind of course, but it's become such a labor of love now. I'm trying hard to succeed, but if it fails or bites the dust, at least I learn along the way to carry that info with future courses I try to build. It plays smooth with no lag it seems, but I didn't realize the plot remembers everything(black grid thingy) & I laid down temp circles in the beginning to help with the black spots I got at 1st when testing things in TW. Now I don't know if it's cool to optimize those spot before going over them again. So much to know with this stuff, but here soon I'm going to help with making real courses. Which is my dream for all this so this is great, and I'm looking very forward to learning, so I can bring cool real courses to others too one day. I will most likely never be able to play these course y'all make , so it is so cool that y'all bring this to our living rooms for us to play.....:)

Thanks again for posting this, and I got some good info from it., but with all this stuff I'm trying to learn right now, it can get very overwhelming at times to make it all stick.....
Squirrely 
 
 
 
 

 
axe360
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Posted: Saturday, July 04, 2009 at 4:24:49 PM | IP Logged

This is awesome advice on how to keep or reduce lag on our courses.

Could it be pinned? 
 
 
 
 

 
nuttywoody
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Posted: Saturday, July 04, 2009 at 6:06:33 PM | IP Logged

edited by: nuttywoody on Thursday, July 30, 2009 at 8:18:00 PM
 
[QUOTE=axe360]This is awesome advice on how to keep or reduce lag on our courses.

Could it be pinned?[/QUOTE]

I would suggest that other experienced designers may also contribute to this thread, and that it could be formatted into a tutorial on the topic of Course Design for Performance or some such.

I think there are probably more tips regarding point count and optimization, architectural details, etc. that might also fit with this. Much of this type of info is scattered throughout many tuts, but I think it would be nice to consolodate under the heading of performance. Thus if a designer had (theres no way to say this without a snicker) perfomance issues, there would be an obvious place for hints. 
 
 
 
 

 
rlslay
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Posted: Monday, July 06, 2009 at 1:58:22 AM | IP Logged

Hey,

I dont know if this can be useful, but i took a snapshot of the tca, i had already cleaned my architect libraries so theres no structures, and deleted mosts sounds for better viewing, if you want to use it, do it, if not deleted. Hope it can help some....rob 
 
 
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Bobby Bolin
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Posted: Monday, July 06, 2009 at 11:15:30 AM | IP Logged

Alt+D will put the hole numbers up in the .tca just in case you didn't know that :) 
 
 
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Squirrely
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Posted: Tuesday, July 07, 2009 at 8:26:42 AM | IP Logged

edited by: Squirrely on Tuesday, July 07, 2009 at 8:27:00 AM
 
Yes, very good idea with making this a sticky thread because this performance stuff as always got me freaking out big time.......

I think I will have OK smooth play(playing with no lag as of right now) with my 1st course, but it will be very demanding so I will probably fail with my attempt to have it play on lower end machines with settings on high, but now that I know things somewhat better, I wont do this on future courses. Always learn something new every time I mess with CA, and I have much more to learn to become a good design like yall, but threads like this help out so much, and are very very appreciated .....:)

Thanks to for the overhead of the full course in CA too, I have much to learn with blending a course together & looking at these type of things give me a good picture of what I need to try to do. Very cool tip with the Atl D for hole numbers too, and I have to go try this out right now matter of fact.....:P

Squirrely 
 
 
 
 

 
studentandsp
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Posted: Friday, July 10, 2009 at 6:56:56 AM | IP Logged

edited by: studentandspo on Friday, July 10, 2009 at 6:58:00 AM
 
ok, fps numbers that are listed in the beginning of this post. I have setup game to show the frame rates, but there are like 3 or 4 sets of numbers, which are the numbers to watch for this best advice topic. Sorry Im new also with all of this, but want to learn. I get numbers that say avg 
 
 
 
 

 
jbcalg
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Posted: Friday, July 10, 2009 at 10:28:19 AM | IP Logged

depends what you use to show the information

edit tw.ini file to show it - several settings seen
fraps (full version logs FPS and other info)
ati tray tools 
 
 
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studentandsp
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Posted: Friday, July 10, 2009 at 2:40:32 PM | IP Logged

yes edited the ini file 
 
 
 
 

 
axe360
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Posted: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 at 1:33:15 PM | IP Logged

Myself, I really don't pay to much attention to fps as I have not learned how to actually change them, I can get good fps's and have lag and vice versa, I can get low fps and have no lag.

It's probly all relative.
 
 
 
 
 

 
BULLPUPP2
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Posted: Tuesday, December 01, 2009 at 11:25:28 PM | IP Logged


Bobby Bolin said:
"Alt+D will put the hole numbers up in the .tca just in case you didn't know that :)"


OMG Bobby. Never knew that!!!

Thanks...Bill 
 
 
 
 

 
Bobby Bolin
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Posted: Wednesday, December 02, 2009 at 2:57:08 PM | IP Logged

Anytime :) 
 
 
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