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Hyno Designs |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Tuesday, September 3, 2019 at
1:09:28 PM |
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After completing Royal Portrush it was decided to go back and redesign St. Sabastian.
Wanted to do new hole signs with Irish themes for both courses and that seems to be put on hold. I don't know how to duplicate structures aka obj files. In time will go back to trying to figure that out.
Wanted to do a companion course to Portrush. Going back and looking at my 1st design or layout ever, decided it was time for a complete overall. This web blog will be a detailed look in to that process.
Needed a new land plot so we exported the holes to the course wizard program.
Taken from an existing post:
Open the course file with the hole you want to export
Pick up all the shapes of the hole and leave all shapes lit up
Press ctrl + alt + E, name your file and save
You will need to take a screen shot of the hole, and make
A 99x292 BMP file. Also make a text file for the hole
Put the hole lsf file, BMP file and text file in Tigers Woods PGA Tour> Data>Architect>Power Catalog> Par 3 or par 4 or par 5 folder for your hole.
Looking at the design it was decided to scrap all the Carnoustie burn holes, all the double greens, and remove all water holes. (This creates freedom to create some new holes or really change some of the old holes.)
The front 9 did some massive rerouting with three brand new holes.
In order to still be able to call this course Royal St. Sabastian, kind of have to leave a remnant or really good clone copies of some of the old holes.
It took a while and finally was able to at least get a fully playable front 9. Was able to lay the holes out, position bunkers, get the elevation the way I wanted, most of the greens were pretty good and it was fully planted with galleries. Went in and tried to fix the gallery issue on hole 8, and wham. The shot point on hole 9 went off the grid, wrecking the file. Because I saved it.
My back up was 3 days old and didn't reflect all the changes and fixes that were made to the layout.
How do you fix this? Used the CLtool and stripped the course file. Now I have the good layout, but it has nothing on it. Loaded up the CA program on another computer so now I am going to copy the planting by looking at the damaged file on one screen and trying to duplicate that on the master file. Can get the size of the bushes, location and the entire 9 yards. Why am I doing this? Planting is really hard to do in the TW game and once you get the look you want you don't want to change it.
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Gunpower61 |
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Belgium |
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| Joined: 12/9/2004 |
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B-Day: 4/30/1961 (63) |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at
11:30:21 AM |
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Hello Hyno, thanks for the update.
Bad luck you had to strip the course, Course architect can be a pain sometimes. |
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at
12:58:57 PM |
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| edited by: Hyno Designs on
Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at
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That is why I am doing these web blogs per say to kind of explain how to overcome some of these issues.
#1 We moved the land plot over to a blank TCA file, that is key for people who messed up the layout or the boarders or whatever.
#2 Have been doing this for years and still when working with galleries can wreck the file sending the shot path off grid.
#3 Not having a current back up is a problem and one I am guilty of.
Really the debate I had was losing 3 days of terrain work vs an old working file. In this case felt the terrain work would be harder to re-do than the planting.
Yesterday did the replanting, did as stated, copied what was done on the damaged TCA.
Played the course once, the copying was pretty good. Some of it looked a bit off, which I am going to fix. This is a fictional design so you can just invent planting. On a real course were you are trying to create a picture of what the real hole looks like you would have lost a lot of time. This copying method using two computers side by side would help.
As I stated in the Portrush web blog, was using three computers which is still hooked up and had the TV about 15 feet away with all the video footage of the British Open. Had the CGX course and the TCG course (which was really good) to help build that course.
This was a last minute idea to rebuild one of my own courses from scratch to make as a companion to Portrush. It is a chance for me personally to show were I have gone in 15 years. The thing is, some of my terrain work when I was new to designing was better than what I can do now. My shaping, planting, greens, detail, overall design is 100 times better. Hole #1 than holes 6 and 8 on the original, looking back was pretty good terrain work. I tried to create hole 8 again, which is now hole 6, giving it the same look and I could not.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 at
5:23:52 PM |
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So back in 05, this was hole 6 on St. Sabastian, at the time it was the wildest hole, I ever created. The terrain work for the time for me was something I've never done. Going to hole 7, had a massive gap, in others words a long walk to the next tee. On the new course wanted to finally bridge the gap putting a new hole on the course.
Because the Ocean was now flipped to the top of the layout rather than at the bottom, this hole was going to hit in to an Ocean back drop. To try to recreate this hole was not really going to work. However wanted the front mound that guarded the green and that front right bunker. It is sad in a way to say goodbye, but it is time to move on.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 at
5:26:44 PM |
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The old 6th hole in now number #3. The terrain is not even close to being as wild however the new hole fits the new design much better.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 at
5:48:48 PM |
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One of my biggest weaknesses on fictional courses was always the Par 5's. This was the old 4th hole which had a burn in front. As I said before, all the burns were going to be removed along with the double greens.
This was a short 5 par before, however playing the 08 release again, really like the elevation work of hitting over bunkers to cut a corner, Liked the cross bunkers you hit over. On the re-do, kept all that the same, however instead of a burn you now have 2 cross bunkers that you hit to a raised green and the hole is 80 yards longer. Because the elevation you can hit the green in 2 shots but you need to find the perfect line off the tee. You can play the tee shot safe out to the right with a 3 wood or 5 wood but the layup is not that easy and hitting in the weed rough takes birdie out of play.
This was kind of interesting. Basically had a tee box and a green were hole 9 was going to go. Which is to the right of 8. Because of all the massive elevation work. Didn't even have to build a hole, it fit in, all I did was put in a few bunkers and built a green. It was a natural hole. Hole 10 ended up being the same as well, pretty much natural in to the landscape.
Here is the new 8th hole from the tee.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 at
6:03:56 PM |
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When this course was released for 08, built one new hole the par 3 15th. Was like maybe I will just build a new par 3. Than was testing out the 08 course. Was like woe, this terrain work is pretty wild how the heck did I even think this up. Was like you know what, will try to copy what was done in the past. All the par 3's are improved copies from the original.
Here is a look of the 08 release than the next post will show the new 15th which again was built on a clean flat tca file.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Saturday, September 14, 2019 at
6:15:34 PM |
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The course thus far has zero trees on it. (It may stay that way) The pic below is the new 15th.
The back 9, only has one brand new hole that is 10. However 11 was a complete redesign so it looks and plays totally different. Hole #13 was better on the 08 release. The back part of the double green was removed. 14 is pretty close to the master. Hole 16 still working on. 17 is changed a bit, mainly bunkers and the dogleg, it is shorter as well. 18 is pretty true to the original. |
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Quietly |
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Canada |
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| Joined: 8/28/2004 |
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| Posted: Sunday, September 15, 2019 at
8:44:26 PM |
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looking forward to seeing the continued progress. I've always appreciated your craftsmanship.
I was just looking through your images and something stuck out at me. This is very nitpicky of me, but the textures seem a little too intense, too colourful compared to the pano (especially in the last pic)
The pano fits the sculptured land so perfectly but I thought it could blend even better. so I put that last image into photoshop and dropped the colour saturation of only the land textures by 40% (as seen in the attached image, on the left side)
All of a sudden the plot just fades right into the pano as if it's one continuous landform.
I'm aware that the game lighting effects can drastically alter the in-game appearance of the textures so it's possible you already have proper colouring.
I tend to obsess over texture libraries when I try to make a course. The point is I would be curious to see the course with a slightly duller pallette of textures.
It was just a thought, do as you wish with it. I'm sure the course will turn out great either way! |
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Hyno Designs |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
2:30:33 AM |
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I like that texture look. Do you have an email that I could send you the textures.
If you read the Portrush blog. I've done something totally new. The EA stock textures have a double texture base. The weed rough texture is a TexMod hybrid.
This course is the same as Portrush with textures. It is Pebble Beach 08, with a custom fringe that I made out of texmods so it blends perfect. The weed rough is Riviera 07 (double stock textures) with my own grass effects converted to K-Club 08.
The pictures I am taking are on an old XP computer and when I hook the game up to my TV with HDMI the color changes. Also these pictures are taken from the 07 engine and the color looks different in 08.
This course and Portrush are hybrids they are designed for 08 and 07.
We can pick a bad EA stock 08 lib, replace all the textures in TexMod with this new color effect. Than see what it looks like.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
3:00:11 AM |
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| edited by: Hyno Designs on
Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
3:34:00 AM
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Did Florida National like 2 years ago, it has never been released. It is an 08 only course. The rough is very simple, it is one texture. With bunkers and everything else the point count overall was too high. Did a Texmod texture of the rough. It should be a perfect copy and look the same. But it does not. Here is a look, this is Doral 08 stock. My water rough texture is the clone texture that does not match up.
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Hyno Designs |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
3:05:19 AM |
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| edited by: Hyno Designs on
Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
3:44:00 AM
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I could not figure this out. Than I thought about it. EA on the stock courses merged two textures in to one. This was done in 07 and 08. 06 is a single texture. That is why we could never make really good base textures in either game. The lighting and the double textures made it impossible.
This is the actually double set of rough used on Doral.
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Hyno Designs |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Wednesday, September 18, 2019 at
3:30:56 AM |
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Here is the 15th hole again in the 08 engine, this is the default sky and weather.
The colors are totally different.
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Hyno Designs |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Tuesday, January 7, 2020 at
6:18:41 AM |
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Wanted to come back to this post and share a few things. I suck at building extras in to a Golf course. Some of these designers are really good at this and in some cases the extras are better than the actual course. Looking at St. Sabastian, the course is done but it is missing any kind of extras and wanted to look at other designers work to come up with ideas. This one blew my mind, Royal Porthcawl by MSR Golf. This guy built a farm. Not only a farm but a farm you would see from like an airplane flying over the course. When you are watching the golf ball fly in the game you have an aerial view. I know I am making a big deal out of this. However, this is next level and beyond creative.
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Hyno Designs |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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| Posted: Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
1:56:26 AM |
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From my last post we are about 8 days out and it basically took that long to add in the extras and do a few hole revisions. As per the Pinehurst #2 post built a new sound lib. One of the cool features I added to the sound lib is two brand new Jet airplane sounds and took and recorded two old classics airplanes from older libs. As stated got a recording of the actual Pinehurst church bells. That is all complete. Had about 150 total sounds and cut it down to about 70.
The 2nd hole on this course was a bridge hole to get to what was the 4th hole on the original course, which is now hole 3. Than I had to bridge another hole to get to my famous classic par 3 with the crazy mounds and no bunkers. The duplication of that Par 3 turned out amazing. All the same features was able to recreate.
The old 3rd hole for me at the time was the most wild and one of the best holes I ever made. Here is the picture from the 05 release. This time around was not able to rebuild that hole but took the actual hole and ported it over and built a similar style green complex. That picture is in this post it is the one Jack Nicklaus is putting and you have a mound on the right of him.
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
2:31:15 AM |
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| edited by: Hyno Designs on
Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
2:44:00 AM
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Back to the extras and bridge holes....
The 2nd hole, could not get the right look nor the elevations the way I wanted. Because of the weed rough texture, it is actually really hard doing mounding work. The mounds blend in to themselves.
The 2nd hole was a nightmare, once you go in to the CA and start changing things up, you tend to mess up everything. The green complex never changed, but everything else, from the elevations, to bunker placements to moving the tee box around to different locations and ect. Actually rebuilt the hole and dropped the bunkers like 10 to 12 times. It is just a work in progress, trying to get the hole the way you want it or what you think up in your head. Than you move the fairway over and you do not like it or than mess up the elevations and now you are going on like 14 hours working on a stupid hole that you had already completed. It finally started clicking today, I think I re-did the hole three times til finally got it pretty close to perfect. Now I am looking at this golf hole saying to myself how the hell did I ever think this hole up. I really did not. It was rebuild after rebuild, changing the planting and massive difference in elevations from one compile of the course to the next. What you get is a mutated hole that you never really designed but revamped it so many times, which finally worked. |
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Hyno Designs |
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United States of America |
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| Joined: 10/24/2004 |
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B-Day: 10/30/1976 (48) |
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Posts: 751 |
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| Posted: Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
2:32:25 AM |
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| edited by: Hyno Designs on
Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
3:09:00 AM
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Here is a look at the 2nd shot in to the green.
Just thought of this, St. Sabastian is the 1st duel course made for both TW 07 and 08. Didn''t plant a tree on the course only bushes from Sawgrass 07, Aviria 07, Firestone 08 and St. Andrews 08. Guess I need to download my 08 course and get the logo and splash screen to use for a duel game release. Going to test the course out tomorrow in 08 and see how it plays.
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joshuajays |
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| Posted: Wednesday, January 15, 2020 at
6:35:15 AM |
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| Looking awesome dude, and thanks for the 2020 PGA players you released last week...I hope you do 2021 also. |
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Gunpower61 |
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| Posted: Thursday, January 16, 2020 at
11:25:47 AM |
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| Great job Hyno, thanks for sharing the pics. |
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